Curse

Reverend Dr · Jan 11, 2012, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

Or you can just put Mirror of Disenchantment on a mesmer and stop the doublecast nonsense in the first place

Considering that it won't stop the on-application effects of the double enchantments, it should be pretty obvious that enchant removal won't do enough. Its the same reason why enchant removal does next to nothing against derv flash enchants.

Daesu · Jan 12, 2012, 04:10 AM // 04:10

I think it would be even harder to do the HM Titan quests after the second part of the ele update. Better finish them now while you still can, they are worth a gold zcoin + other rewards each quest. One gold zcoin is easily tradable for 2 ectos.

If you are interested to finish them using your heroes, refer to this thread:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/h...t10498916.html

Martin Alvito · Jan 12, 2012, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

necs or rend touch/rending sweep dervs = win.

Right, but forcing opponents to surrender skill slots, casting time and energy on counters confers an advantage. For five lousy energy, Stone Sheath forces the opponent to clean Weakness from (multiple?) melee, applies (another?) enchantment that has to be ripped for most spikes to go through, and throws some damage in for good measure.

Oh, and with decent awareness you can even use it like BSurge to help catch spikes. Gimping a spike by a couple hundred damage usually makes it a lot less lethal. At worst you're covering something else you didn't want Shattered and sneaking a Weakness in as well.

urania · Jan 12, 2012, 03:07 PM // 15:07

yea, it's stupid.

but as far as spike countering goes, i think gust takes the 1st prize. if they actually adjust stone sheath it will most definitely be the next elite of choice.

Essence Snow · Jan 12, 2012, 06:40 PM // 18:40

Idk if anyone else noticed (i'm sure some have) that you can cast the double cast skills on yourself and still get 2x the dmg. This includes stone sheath, mirror of ice, and gust. Double dragon does not give the 2x dmg when self targeted.

Relyk · Jan 12, 2012, 09:08 PM // 21:08

It's been noted on all the guildwarswiki pages Essence

Energy Boon doesn't give double energy either.

Avatar Exico · Jan 12, 2012, 09:46 PM // 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essence Snow

Idk if anyone else noticed (i'm sure some have) that you can cast the double cast skills on yourself and still get 2x the dmg. This includes stone sheath, mirror of ice, and gust. Double dragon does not give the 2x dmg when self targeted.

I didn't get a screenshot, but I saw when doing eotn mission. Target a foe and cast DD on myself but also it cast DD on like 3 other allies at the same time, soo whole party had DD doing mega dmg to mobs near us.

Swingline · Jan 13, 2012, 12:02 AM // 00:02

An update just hit for AI usage of DD, Stone Sheath, MoI and Gust. Also a bug fix for freezing gust. Hope the AI uses the skills properly now

----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

Right, but forcing opponents to surrender skill slots, casting time and energy on counters confers an advantage.

Unfortunately the solution to such power creep as Stone Sheath is more power creep or a big nerf to it. If no nerf then this game will collapse into itself like a neutron star.

MithranArkanere · Jan 13, 2012, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Oh, that's true.

I noticed how heroes used waaay often the doublecasts on my character as an assassin.

Haven't had that much fun as an assassin in ages. And it was just with a Stone Sheath and Double Dragon elementalists.

That' 1.5 casting time is also great.
I never though I'll ever put fireball and obsidian flame back in a hero build ever again. But now they feel much fluent in both players and heroes.
While playing a Lich MM with Death Nova, came to me that Death Nova could use that 1.5 casting time too. Even when I heal them with blood of the master before using nova, minions tend to die right before Death Nova activates during battle.

Martin Alvito · Jan 13, 2012, 03:01 AM // 03:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

but as far as spike countering goes, i think gust takes the 1st prize. if they actually adjust stone sheath it will most definitely be the next elite of choice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swingline

Unfortunately the solution to such power creep as Stone Sheath is more power creep or a big nerf to it.

I agree with these two statements above...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swingline

If no nerf then this game will collapse into itself like a neutron star.

...but the game already did that a long time ago as a result of the Nightfall and EoTN power creep, which broke PvP and PvE respectively.

Swingline · Jan 13, 2012, 01:29 PM // 13:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

...but the game already did that a long time ago as a result of the Nightfall and EoTN power creep, which broke PvP and PvE respectively.

Yes that is true. It's easy to forget because it feels like 100 years since NF and EoTN was released. It's about to do it again however with skills like the new Stone Sheath. A future nerf for this skill is inevitable.

Stone Sheath is not about stopping power but about pushing teams into a corner. It gives amazing defense through armor, crit immunity and weakness for prolonged periods of time unless stripped and cleaned. Then theres the damage. I shudder at 4 stone sheath eles with obby flame for spikes.

Essence Snow · Jan 13, 2012, 01:52 PM // 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swingline

Yes that is true. It's easy to forget because it feels like 100 years since NF and EoTN was released. It's about to do it again however with skills like the new Stone Sheath. A future nerf for this skill is inevitable.

Hopefully not a full nerf but a split. Really aggrivating when PvP, which is basically dead...so who cares outside of few sqeaky wheels, makes skills useless in PvE where more ppl actually care but aren't as vocal. I'm all for a split but HELL NO for full nerf.

Lanier · Jan 13, 2012, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essence Snow

Hopefully not a full nerf but a split. Really aggrivating when PvP, which is basically dead...so who cares outside of few sqeaky wheels, makes skills useless in PvE where more ppl actually care but aren't as vocal. I'm all for a split but HELL NO for full nerf.

I agree with this. Stone Sheath seems pretty well balanced for PvE, and it would be a shame to see it nerfed in the format.

Mouse at Large · Jan 13, 2012, 09:19 PM // 21:19

Stone Sheath is fine in PvE. Mostly useful for farming or for very specialised groups. If it seriously screws PvP (as opposed to forcing players to adapt/adjust the meta) then split it.

No more of the tail wagging the dog please

*Edit* Just had a trawl through obs mode. If Stone Sheath was game breaking in PvP, I'd expect to see multiple copies being run in ele biassed teams. If it's taken at all, it's generally on a single ele and most teams were running a max of 2 eles. That's not a broken skill, it's just shifting a stale meta imo.

AndrewSX · Jan 13, 2012, 10:52 PM // 22:52

Well, now Double cast spells deserves a slot in a hero team.

Tried Gust oon Zhed while VQing with my sin. Was nice to see almost full groups of mobs KD'ed while i was destroying them with dagger. Turned useful to stop wars running back a healer too.

*lemming* · Jan 14, 2012, 10:57 AM // 10:57

rofl stone sheath

ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

Gill Halendt · Jan 14, 2012, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Somehow I missed Stone Sheath... It's absolutely retarded.

Geez, whatever they're smoking, I want some.

Lanier · Jan 14, 2012, 04:55 PM // 16:55

This is a question for the PvP folks: Why is the buff to Stone Sheath a bad thing in pvp? With all of the powercreep to offensive skills, I would think that having a new defensive skill that can slow down spikes would be a good thing. Of course, I don't know about pvp, hence why I'm asking this question.

Missing HB · Jan 14, 2012, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemming

rofl stone sheath

ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

Exactly my point.. Went Heroes Ascent for once as it was the only time a little active due to zquest and i probably won't ever go back then until something is done with earth eles...

This is beyond pathetic, every single team has stonesheath ele with other crap spams.. It has too low energy cast and recharge, which means the ele can still even be useful spamming it only..Removing earth attunement is basicaly the point, but SS spam is still enough annoying( and there's glyph anyway...). It makes some situations even more joke they are( lol 1v1 king of the hill against rit + 2 monks + stonesheath ele, which is clearly impossible to win as red as long as they keep no dp on the map...)...

Most fights are lasting 15mn, even monks with no energy can do the job as you need at least 3 melees to be able to deal damage with weakness( having only 1 melee will make that ele laugh...)...

When you were thinking about if something worse than invoke could be done, clearly yes(and there is still shockwave doing same damage with additional blind, bsurge still doing blind ith additional damage, etc...)

The main problem is that clearly, the way to counter this would be some kind of spikes, but then the flux says hi...

Side note: i'm not even going to argue how joke FA on kurzick side is with stonesheath el/mo( healer)

Kunder · Jan 14, 2012, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

This is a question for the PvP folks: Why is the buff to Stone Sheath a bad thing in pvp? With all of the powercreep to offensive skills, I would think that having a new defensive skill that can slow down spikes would be a good thing. Of course, I don't know about pvp, hence why I'm asking this question.

Because ~50% less damage vs casters and ~90% less damage vs physicals is 10x more than any powercreep that ever occurred. If it was a short duration prot then it would be fine, but as it is you put it on your bar and effectively 2 characters + you are invincible for the match. Noone has a chance to spike down a character in the backline that is more heavily protected than a frontliner. And don't even think about pressuring with a frontliner, you might as well start wanding them.